Obsessive behavior

[Pistol_Pete]

Hello, I'm new here, and I could use some advice. My 96 yr. old mother
is starting to suffer from dementia, and I would like to know how to
handle one piece of her behavior. Her doctor now thinks she has
“vascular dementia” which is not the same brain conditions as
Alzheimer's but the dementia is very similar. For a while, the doctor
was calling it delirium, which may have been treatable, and which
could have been caused by lack of oxygen to the brain, especially
while Mom slept. So she prescribed an oxygen machine to be used at
night.

Well, Mom has become obsessed with the machine. She sits in her
bedroom, turning the machine on and off; she puts the nose piece in
and tries to make her bed, even though the tube isn't long enough.
Whenever anyone comes to her apartment (and a lot of people come in:
PT, OT, RN, speech therapy, meal escorts, bath and dressing help) she
wants them to show her how to use the machine. We're talking six times
a day or more. The really weird part is that sometimes she'll get
ready for bed before the helper comes, and she turns the machine on
and puts on the nose piece all by herself. The helpers say they come
and Mom is sound asleep, with the O2 on. We had her to our house for
dinner recently and she was having an extremely lucid day, except she
kept trying to turn the conversation to her oxygen machine whenever
she could.

So what should we do about this obsession? It seems to make her only
slightly agitated, but it's the only thing in her life right now. Or
should we do nothing? I should say that the doctor thinks she should
keep using the oxygen, ever though we are not seeing any effect.

[Alan Meyer]

Post by Pistol_Pete
Hello, I'm new here, and I could use some advice. My 96 yr. old mother
is starting to suffer from dementia, and I would like to know how to
handle one piece of her behavior. Her doctor now thinks she has
“vascular dementia” which is not the same brain conditions as
Alzheimer's but the dementia is very similar. For a while, the doctor
was calling it delirium, which may have been treatable, and which
could have been caused by lack of oxygen to the brain, especially
while Mom slept. So she prescribed an oxygen machine to be used at
night.

Let me begin by saying that I'm not a doctor or expert of any kind. I'm
not qualified to express any opinion about whether this treatment could
do you mother any good.

Let me start with some questions about it. Did the doctor perform some
test to determine that your Mom was in need of more oxygen? Or is his
prescription purely hypothetical? Is he offering this treatment as a
way to compensate for past brain damage due to oxygen deprivation and
improve mental functioning, or only as a way to try to prevent further
damage?

If it is all hypothetical, the doctor may have innocently imagined that
he was offering a non-invasive treatment that might help and wouldn't
hurt. He had no way of knowing that this would become an obsession for
your Mom that had significant implications of its own. He may not even
have believed himself that this would do any good, but hated to turn you
away with no help at all and was hoping that this "treatment" would
placate you and your Mom and make you both feel better.

I suggest getting a second opinion from another neurologist with
experience with dementia. Ask if this treatment is likely to help. Ask
if there's a scientific way to determine if it's helping. Ask if
there's an alternative approach to achieving the same thing (for example
some people take ginko biloba on the theory that it allows more oxygen
into the brain.)

If it really doesn't look like this is helping and you believe it is
best to get rid of the oxygen fixation, you may be able to substitute
something. For example, you may be able to convince your Mom that the
doctor has found these ginko biloba pills (or whatever), and they do
everything the oxygen did but more and easier.

Maybe someone else here has experience with oxygen treatment and can say
more.

Best of luck to you and your Mom.

Alan

[Lynn Lynn]

Welcome - sorry you are dealing with the effects of dementia in your
family!


Mom had a stroke and was put on oxygen and then sent to Hospice. She
became better, was taken off oxygen and when I brought her to live with
me Hospice sent all kinds of oxygen equipment - permanent, portable,
etc. I left it all in the garage and one day asked the nurse if I
really had to have all of that. She said "no" and had it taken away.
Never did use it or miss it.

Of course, there were other obsessive behaviors to deal with - that is
just part of the dementia.

I agree with getting a second opinion about the oxygen. Might as well
give your Mother as much piece of mind as you can - it is difficult
enough for them.

Please keep us posted and stop in whenever you need to talk or need a
hug. Most of us have been there - done that!

Lynn

[EddyJean]

Obsessive behavior

Group: alt.support.alzheimers Date: Mon, Jan 31, 2011, 10:09am From:
***@inbox.com (Pistol_Pete)
Hello, I'm new here, and I could use some advice. My 96 yr. old mother
is starting to suffer from dementia, and I would like to know how to
handle one piece of her behavior. Her doctor now thinks she has
"vascular dementia" which is not the same brain conditions as
Alzheimer's but the dementia is very similar. For a while, the doctor
was calling it delirium, which may have been treatable, and which could
have been caused by lack of oxygen to the brain, especially while Mom
slept. So she prescribed an oxygen machine to be used at night.
Well, Mom has become obsessed with the machine. She sits in her bedroom,
turning the machine on and off; she puts the nose piece in and tries to
make her bed, even though the tube isn't long enough. Whenever anyone
comes to her apartment (and a lot of people come in: PT, OT, RN, speech
therapy, meal escorts, bath and dressing help) she wants them to show
her how to use the machine. We're talking six times a day or more. The
really weird part is that sometimes she'll get ready for bed before the
helper comes, and she turns the machine on and puts on the nose piece
all by herself. The helpers say they come and Mom is sound asleep, with
the O2 on. We had her to our house for dinner recently and she was
having an extremely lucid day, except she kept trying to turn the
conversation to her oxygen machine whenever she could.
So what should we do about this obsession? It seems to make her only
slightly agitated, but it's the only thing in her life right now. Or
should we do nothing? I should say that the doctor thinks she should
keep using the oxygen, ever though we are not seeing any effect.
++++++++
Some in alternative medicine use oxygen claiming good results. People
with dementias often suffer from insomnia unable to sleep. If the oxygen
helps your mother to get a good night's sleep or daytime naps, why
should it be anything to worry about? Being able to sleep well is good
for the body and recommended by her doctor.
Best regards,
EddyJean

[Pistol_Pete]

It's not the oxygen itself I'm concerned about, it's the obsessive
behavior. From some of the answers it looks like obsessions are common
with dementia; is that right? Is there anything I should be doing
about it? Should I fight it, ignore it, accommodate it, or what? Is
taking away the source of her obsession a good or a bad idea (ignoring
for this discussion the therapeutic benefit of the oxygen)?

Mom has only just started declining mentally over the last three
months. It has been rapid, and I am completely new to dealing with it.
I just want to know how to help her.

[Lynn Lynn]

I, myself, had to deal wih a lot of obsessive behaviors with Mom. You
just have to "go with the flow" and change what you can.

One of Mom's was tissue. I would find little pieces of it everywhere.

She would also want her purse and would sit and take things out of it
and put them back in over and over.

I could go on and on but you get the idea.

I feel like I fought a lot of them in the beginning but learned it was
much easier to go along with them as long as there was no danger to Mom.

As far as the oxygen helping your Mom sleep, I doubt she sleeps much
anyway. My Mom woke me up so many times during the night.

It sounds like the machine is really frustrating her and you certainly
don't need that.

Lynn

[Evelyn]

Post by Lynn Lynn
I, myself, had to deal wih a lot of obsessive behaviors with Mom. You
just have to "go with the flow" and change what you can.
One of Mom's was tissue. I would find little pieces of it everywhere.
She would also want her purse and would sit and take things out of it
and put them back in over and over.
I could go on and on but you get the idea.
I feel like I fought a lot of them in the beginning but learned it was
much easier to go along with them as long as there was no danger to Mom.
As far as the oxygen helping your Mom sleep, I doubt she sleeps much
anyway. My Mom woke me up so many times during the night.
It sounds like the machine is really frustrating her and you certainly
don't need that.
Lynn

I would tend to agree with Lynn.

A person who is dealing with alzheimers disease gets obsessive enough
without the additional hassle and responsibility of using an oxygen
machine. It doesn't sound like it will help, as much as hinder. Even
using a CPAP machine takes a lot of getting used to.

We found that the particular combination of medications my mother in
law was on helped only a little with obsessions, but even that little
bit was a huge help, when we saw how bad it got if she wasn't on them.
My mother in law was on Zoloft, an anti-depressant and later on,
Risperdol which helped with delusions and obsessions.

Medications also have their drawbacks, but in dealing with an illness
as devastating and difficult you have to pick your battles according
to your own circumstances and abilities. For us, dealing with the
medication was easier than dealing with the obsessions and delusions.

Hope it works out for you, Pete.

Evelyn

[Alan Meyer]

Post by Pistol_Pete
It's not the oxygen itself I'm concerned about, it's the obsessive
behavior. From some of the answers it looks like obsessions are common
with dementia; is that right? Is there anything I should be doing
about it? Should I fight it, ignore it, accommodate it, or what? Is
taking away the source of her obsession a good or a bad idea (ignoring
for this discussion the therapeutic benefit of the oxygen)?
Mom has only just started declining mentally over the last three
months. It has been rapid, and I am completely new to dealing with it.
I just want to know how to help her.

I don't know the answers. I don't know if anyone does.

As far as I can tell, the principle of the thing is something like this:
Try to figure our what your Mom is trying to get in her obsession, and
find a way to give it to her.

Maybe she knows that she is in trouble and is trying to find a way to
help herself. Maybe she sees working with the oxygen system as
something that she can do to help herself. If so, then anything you can
do to make her feel that she's fighting against her problem is to the good.

Or maybe it's something else entirely. It's hard enough to know
anyone's internal emotional needs and can be harder with a person facing
serious trouble with reduced capability to deal with it.

I think that the key thing is to understand the emotional need as best
you can, and do whatever you can do to meet it in a way that is safe and
supportive for your Mom.

It may be that the best thing to do is to work with her on the oxygen
system. Assuming that it's doing her no harm, maybe it's not a bad
thing to help her use it. Maybe you can figure out what is most
frustrating for her in using the system, what is easiest for her to do,
and direct her energy into paths that are easiest for her and provide
her with the most comfort.

Sometimes there reaches a point in a person's life when conventional
truths no longer apply. When a terminal cancer patient is in pain it
really doesn't matter if the patient becomes addicted. It doesn't
matter if the pain meds have negative health implications. We give him
what he needs for the central problem in his life.

Your Mom is near the end of her life. At this point, whatever she needs
is what she should get. It may be drugs. It may be deceptions that
serve her emotional needs even if they involve saying things to her that
aren't really true.

Perhaps there is something calming and pleasurable that you can focus
her attention on. If you told her that someone gave you a pound of
special tea that would help her, and helped her to brew it, or that you
got some wonderful music from a doctor that would help her, and it's
soothing and relaxing music for which you've given her some kind of
music player that she can work - whatever will help her to find some
peace and contentment in the terrible ordeal she is going through may be
the best thing you can do.

Don't worry that you may be deceiving her a little. Alzheimer's
caregivers call these "loving deceptions", and they really are exactly that.

It is obvious that you are trying to do your very best for your mother.
She is lucky that she has you to rely upon. I think that you should
do what you can for her and also understand that there is nothing that
you can do to save her or to solve her problem. All that you can do is
to support her in her final journey.

But that is enough. The support you are giving is a wonderful thing.

Best of luck.

Alan

[June]

"Alan Meyer" wrote in message news:iia6gb$acg$***@news.eternal-september.org...
I don't know the answers. I don't know if anyone does.

As far as I can tell, the principle of the thing is something like this:
Try to figure our what your Mom is trying to get in her obsession, and
find a way to give it to her.

Maybe she knows that she is in trouble and is trying to find a way to
help herself. Maybe she sees working with the oxygen system as
something that she can do to help herself. If so, then anything you can
do to make her feel that she's fighting against her problem is to the good.

Or maybe it's something else entirely. It's hard enough to know
anyone's internal emotional needs and can be harder with a person facing
serious trouble with reduced capability to deal with it.

I think that the key thing is to understand the emotional need as best
you can, and do whatever you can do to meet it in a way that is safe and
supportive for your Mom.

It may be that the best thing to do is to work with her on the oxygen
system. Assuming that it's doing her no harm, maybe it's not a bad
thing to help her use it. Maybe you can figure out what is most
frustrating for her in using the system, what is easiest for her to do,
and direct her energy into paths that are easiest for her and provide
her with the most comfort.

Sometimes there reaches a point in a person's life when conventional
truths no longer apply. When a terminal cancer patient is in pain it
really doesn't matter if the patient becomes addicted. It doesn't
matter if the pain meds have negative health implications. We give him
what he needs for the central problem in his life.

Your Mom is near the end of her life. At this point, whatever she needs
is what she should get. It may be drugs. It may be deceptions that
serve her emotional needs even if they involve saying things to her that
aren't really true.

Perhaps there is something calming and pleasurable that you can focus
her attention on. If you told her that someone gave you a pound of
special tea that would help her, and helped her to brew it, or that you
got some wonderful music from a doctor that would help her, and it's
soothing and relaxing music for which you've given her some kind of
music player that she can work - whatever will help her to find some
peace and contentment in the terrible ordeal she is going through may be
the best thing you can do.

Don't worry that you may be deceiving her a little. Alzheimer's
caregivers call these "loving deceptions", and they really are exactly that.

It is obvious that you are trying to do your very best for your mother.
She is lucky that she has you to rely upon. I think that you should
do what you can for her and also understand that there is nothing that
you can do to save her or to solve her problem. All that you can do is
to support her in her final journey.

But that is enough. The support you are giving is a wonderful thing.

Best of luck.

Alan

I like Alan's answers. My MIL went from totally lucid to full dementia in
a month at the age of 100. She put herself in the nursing home after a
fall because she knew it would be impossible for her elderly kids to take
care of her. The staff at the nursing home said they had never seen it set
in so fast. She refused to walk or do any therapy and was prepared to die.
I posted here and someone suggested that because of her inactivity the blood
wasn't flowing to the brain. She mainly had hallucinations. Quite frankly
I don't think she ever had Alzheimer's even though the doctor put it on her
death certificate. She refused to eat and lasted only a few months.
I still envy her quality of life for the first 100 years.....June

[Pistol_Pete]

Yes, June, I like Alan's answer, too. Thanks Alan. When I saw Mom
today I just went with her and let her show me the machine. She didn't
spend an inordinate amount of time at it today. Today was a good day
for her, and maybe she's getting used to the machine as time goes on.
I guess we'll see what tomorrow brings.

Thank you very much to all who replied.

Pete

[Strobe]

Post by Pistol_Pete
Yes, June, I like Alan's answer, too. Thanks Alan. When I saw Mom
today I just went with her and let her show me the machine. She didn't
spend an inordinate amount of time at it today. Today was a good day
for her, and maybe she's getting used to the machine as time goes on.
I guess we'll see what tomorrow brings.
Thank you very much to all who replied.

Enjoy her good days.
Ignore the others.

And go along with whatever makes your Mom happy.

[Mary Gordon]

Here is a really excellent article on the experience of dementia.
http://www.alzheimer.guelph.org/downloads/12%20pt%20Understanding%20the%20Dementia%20Experience.pdf

It's full of helpful explanations on how memory works, and insights
into some of the behaviors - including the obsessive stuff. I think
it's worth printing out and rereading a few times.

Mary